Mindful Monday’s

Transcript

Michelle

Hello and welcome to Mindful Mondays. My name is Michelle Precourt, and it is a pleasure to be here with you today. Before we get started into this really important topic, I do want to make a couple of notes here first, wherever you're calling in from this includes you Tara, I'd like to invite you to take a moment to acknowledge the Indigenous communities on where you're calling in from today. I am a descendant of the Manitoba Métis however I do recognize that I'm a settler here on lands of the Sḵwx̱wú7mesh people, otherwise known as Squamish, British Columbia. If you're not aware, June is National Indigenous History Month. And two days from now, isn't it a National Indigenous Peoples day? So it's an opportunity for us to continue to learn from the individuals who were here before us.

For those of you who are joining us for the first time today, welcome to Mindful Mondays. This is really a conversation about sometimes, difficult topics like career-related stress, like corporate culture, retention, and mental health at work. Today, we're going to dive into this a little bit more, mental health at work. But the end results, the end goal, not sure about the result, I'd love to say that there's a result, but the goal is to create healthier, more sustainable workplace cultures. And Tara has some things to say about that today. It leads us really nicely into our conversation. So hello, and welcome, Tara.

Tara

Thank you. Hi, Michelle. So lovely to be here. And thank you for that very genuine, beautiful land acknowledgement.

Michelle

You're welcome. I would like, it's showing up in the chat here. But to our viewers, please tell us where you're calling in from, we'd love to see. We've had folks from coast to coast to coast. We've had folks internationally, wherever you're calling in from please do drop that in the chat. And as well, if you've got any questions for Tara. We have about 30 minutes of Tara's time. She's a busy person. She's busy because I love this. I asked her to tell me a little bit about herself. And aside from doing this work with Abridge Consulting, which she founded in 2020, she focuses on workplace wellness, and workplace mental health, and she has a focus on workplace suicide prevention. So some big, big things. But in addition to that, she has one spouse, two kids, two dogs, two minivans and four tennis rackets. And I love that, Tara, thanks for sharing that about you.

Tara

Yeah, my work can be heavy. There's some emotional labour for sure. So I also tried to balance that with a little bit of fun. My pets, my kids, my tennis rackets. Those are the most important things to me.

Michelle

That's awesome. So we're talking about suicide prevention. And I know you have some things to say about this before we dive in.

Tara

Sure, sure. So it is my favourite topic. It's very unusual. It's not most people's favourite topic, you might get a better sense of why after our conversation today, but for those who are listening, watching and joining us today, first of all, thank you. And what we're going to do is set what I like to call psychological health and safety before we talk about the S-word. And what that means is we want everyone to feel safe and everyone to feel heard. The way that we do that is that we will collectively agree that we are in a group level of conversation today. And what that means is that there is a lot of lived experience around suicide in our virtual room today, including my own. And that in a group level of conversation, we all agree that we're going to keep things quite a high level because of the lived experience because we want folks to feel safe and heard. So hopefully that makes everybody breathe a little bit of a sigh of relief. I won't say that the topic is very very comfortable for most folks, but hopefully now a little bit more comfortable so we can start chatting about suicide at high-level rules about some ideas. I don't think I can see the participants So you'll have to share with me if folks are doing things. But I would love this to be a conversation, especially early on a Monday.

Michelle

Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I was having a little bit of tech issues here on the back end. So I'm hoping that we are, I know that we are live, I'm hoping that folks on LinkedIn can actually see us. That's what I'm hoping. But regardless, we're going to continue the conversation. And if we are unable for it, we're not like live, it says I'm live but if we're having some tech issues, this will be available online in a couple of different formats on LinkedIn, and then on my website, and I'll get that to you, Tara as well. Great. Okay, so let's take a look here at what's going on. And if folks are joining us on LinkedIn, please do share in the chat this way, I will know that you're here with us. So Tara, if if we go back to August 2021. So just over a year ago, you were my first guest on Mindful Monday. So I want to thank you so much for helping me to kick off this podcast and also for coming back today. So thank you.

Tara

You're welcome.

Michelle

I also know that you're quite passionate about this particular topic, suicide prevention. I also know that you're one of the few very few who specialize in this particular topic, in this context, suicide prevention in the workplace. So what's your backstory? And how did Abridge Consulting come to be?

Tara

Well, the quick, the quick story is that I found myself doing corporate training, I actually worked in a financial institution. And I did all kinds of interesting training there for the employees there. Eventually, I landed in workplace health and wellness, but it was early, early days, and this was an unusual job. This was an unusual space. This was in 2014. I know because I was just coming back from mat leave. So I found myself in this sort of corporate health and wellness space. Over the years that morphed into basically workplace mental health as the highest need, highest want, and highest cost to most organizations. And as that progressed, I certainly enjoyed working within one organization. But you could see that there was a huge gap. And I wanted to fill that gap and really work with more than one organization, I'm happy to say I still work with that organization on a frequent basis. I love it. I love to see the folks I worked with there. So now, here we are almost three years after I went out on my own. And my vision at the beginning was all workplace mental health. That was it, anybody. There's lots to do, there were loads of folks in this space. And then there was this idea of workplace suicide prevention. And honestly, there's fantastic suicide prevention work being done all around the world, particularly in Australia, New Zealand, us, but not a lot of it is customized to the workplace. And that became a gap that I really fell into happily, and then started to specialize in research and practice and deliver and train and mould, some courses that I wrote. And then into the last year or so I found many of us were quite fatigued and exhausted during the first three years of the pandemic, I'm sure folks can relate. And a lot of my clients said to me, I absolutely understand the business case to do workplace mental health work. And I understand what you're saying about the need to do workplace suicide prevention. You can do it or not do it, it's still there. But folks need some lighter, softer happier. And so I have been doing more work in what I would call the well-being space, not the mindfulness. That's your expertise, Michelle, but a lot of chatting around connection and self-care and well-being. So those are kind of my three buckets now the self-care connection, well-being still lots of mental health, and then really getting specific and specializing in workplace suicide prevention. Not the community, not healthcare, not youth. Not all that we have amazing folks, in all those demographics that specialize Yeah.

Michelle

Yeah. Yeah, that self-care, I think is a really important component to this.

Tara

That's what's really on my mind lately. It was so interesting when I'm up at night thinking about things I think about, sort of the spectrum of self-care, peer support, professional care, suicide prevention, and how can I tie messages around self-care into suicide prevention? It's certainly more than, certainly much, much more than that. But tying all that "s" words together. I don't know. I've been playing with it lately.

Michelle

Yeah, yeah, that's excellent. Tara, I just want to I know we're live. Well, we are live. But I don't think our folks on LinkedIn are able to connect with us. So one of two things we can do, we can just carry on or we can end the broadcast, and reconnect and see if that works. What do you want to do?

Tara

Well, if there are folks trying to join, do you want to do a quick retry, and then we'll keep it shorter and sweeter?

Michelle

Yep. Okay. Let's do that. Because I was expecting to see some things in the chat already. It's not happening so well, for anyone who may be here. I don't know that there is anyone here but if anyone is here, we'll be right back.

Tara

So leave the studio and come back. Yeah. Okay. Can do. Thanks.

Michelle

Thanks. So we're back. Sorry, folks, for anyone who we had to drop. I was I have now been informed that we were in fact live. And people could see us, but I couldn't see anything in the chat. So here we are, again, we will carry on the conversation. And as if nothing happened, right? Technology never fails us right Tara?

Tara

Stay calm, carry on.

Michelle

Stay calm carry on. Okay. So thank you for sharing your little bit of the backstory where we left off around self-care. Yes, one of the things that I know is important to you, Tara and the work that you do at Abridge Consulting is reducing the stigma. And suicide prevention is not something that we talk about regularly, right? But should we? And if we do, what does that look like?

Tara

Well, in my dream world, we all can talk a little bit more about suicide, the S-word and we get to a place where we can use that word in a way that's safe and comfortable, ish, maybe not completely comfortable. It's really, really important. So without doing any training for folks, today, a couple of things to leave you with is that thoughts of suicide are much, much more common than folks may think. And thoughts of suicide are serious. So if you can go from a place of thoughts of suicide, serious thoughts of suicide are common. We need to be able to talk to folks. We do. Usually what I do in any training class, even if it's not specifically around suicide prevention, I always sneak it in is I will say to the group, no matter how big or small, hands up, if you have been in a conversation that included suicide, ever, and again, keeping our psychological health and safety, it's a yes or no, it's not sharing the stories. So I will tell you that at a high level in the last five years, the lowest answer I've ever had in any group ever is 1/3. The highest I've had is 100% several times, while the average is two-thirds. So if you were to say that two-thirds of the folks that I have the chance to connect with have said yes, I've been in a conversation around suicide. The second question is yes or no. Again, have you had suicide prevention training? The answer is usually just me. Sometimes there are a couple of folks. And that's always great to see. So the way that I like to start the conversation is to acknowledge the gap, that thoughts of suicide are common. We have a breadth of lived experience around this topic, including my own, and the gap between the conversations we're finding ourselves in, and the training, we have to deal with those conversations is immense. And that's what makes me really, really excited. So if we can reduce the stigma, and give folks a couple of small tools to even get started, it doesn't have to be classified as training. We're just missing the opportunity where we have to be able to connect and talk about it. So do you want me to give you a couple of quick things to perhaps say or not say without a huge training?

Michelle

Yeah, please, that would be great.

Tara

So acknowledging that thoughts of suicide are common and serious is really important. And also using the right language. And I often say I'm not the word police, and the words don't change everything. But the words are something in our control. And that's what always makes me excited about the word. So when you're thoughtful with body language and tone of voice, of course, but also the words you choose, every one of us can reduce stigma. So the most important thing we're going to do is try our hardest to remove the word committed. So aside from our topic today, if I said do you use commit in a sentence, the most common response is commit fraud, commit a crime, that type of thing. So we want to move away from committing suicide is not selfish, it's not a crime. And we want to start saying that people die by suicide, for many reasons. First of all, if you just take my own lived experience, I would like you and I to talk more positively about the people I lost, they died by suicide, they didn't commit suicide. Also, if you are talking to me about someone I lost, or around this topic, it impacts me. Right? So the words are very important to me. And then the other one, because again, reinforcing the thoughts of suicide are very, very common is that I want us to move away from saying that person is suicidal, like, suicidal, people have thoughts of suicide, and it feels like a mouthful at first, right? Well, if you are suicidal is easier to say that you have thoughts of suicide. But it's such a huge difference, because it's not all of who I am, I'm a holder. And I also may have thoughts of suicide, I may have them for a short amount of time, a long amount of time, I may never do anything about them. I may live with thoughts of suicide my whole life, it might be a crisis, if there are all kinds of things that may happen there. And then my last sort of free, take it or leave it, is if you don't have suicide prevention training as the majority of folks, then I want you to have something in your own words, where if you found yourself, as I said, in that conversation, at least two-thirds of us have found ourselves there, at least have something to say right away. Somebody shared with you their thoughts of suicide, I want you to say, I don't know what to say right now. But I'm so glad you told me just have something right out of the gates. And I find that that will take the pressure off the person who's trying to help, and the person who may have just been brave enough to share this with you. So if we just sort of take all the pressure down for a moment, I don't have a lot of training. Now, if you do have a lot of training, you will say some very different things. But if you don't, I want you to say, I don't really know what to do right now. But I'm really glad you told me. Yeah, yeah, so we don't have a lot of time to do too much. But I wanted to give folks a little bit of language there. So people die by suicide, and people have thoughts of suicide. If you find yourself in these conversations, I want you to be able to say, I don't have all the answers, but I'm so glad you told me. I don't know what to do next. But I'm so glad you told me something like that.

Michelle

Yeah, thanks. Thanks very much. Tara hadn't considered it from that perspective. And if folks are just joining us, now we're speaking with Tara Adams from Abridge Consulting who does focused work around workplace prevention and workplace suicide prevention. And I so agree with what you said there, the I am statements, I am more than a woman, I am more than a, you know, an HR professional, I am more than a consultant and more than a spouse, I'm more than the thoughts in my head, right. And I think that that is a really good place to start something really simple. That doesn't require a lot of formal training, the formal training is amazing. And, you know, I do want to get to that, because I have not been formally trained. And even if I think back to the HR training that I took with the University of Manitoba, I don't recall, it was a long time ago. But I don't think that mental health was really a focus, I hope that it is now for many undergrads, and graduate degrees because they think that it's relevant to all kinds of professions. Suicidal thoughts aren't exclusive to any, you know, any person, any culture, any workplace. Yeah, so it's, um, and it's really, it's really big. But I appreciate some of those subtleties because again, I never thought about the word committed. And it's so true. It is so true. If there are any questions, please share those in the chat. Love Tara, love for you to be able to ask her some questions because so much knowledge here. So, from a psychological safety perspective, of course, I'm not going to get into details but I have personally been exposed to suicide in the workplace on a few occasions, and I didn't see the signs. Right. So my question for you is, and I suspect that that resonates with other people, Tara, what should we be looking for? Is there something that we should be looking for, is there something that, you know, we could prepare for any words of advice around this?

Tara

Well, in the absence of training, not every organization has the resources to do that. So in the absence of training, follow your gut. Be brave, ask, notice, connect, you don't need all the answers. However, I will say that my absolute dream is that a very high-level intro to suicide prevention is part of onboarding that folks boarded into your culture with at least an hour of being aware of suicide prevention and resources because that would cover just an amazing opportunity. So in it, and it does, it removes a lot of stigma when you include something in onboarding, because it isn't like, hey, Michelle, I want to talk to you about suicide prevention training, this is how we do things. This is how we care about people. This is how we reduce your stress, and build your confidence by making sure you have some basic tools. So my dream come true would be that a little bit of suicide prevention is part of onboarding people into any organization, and particularly part of leadership development. I know for many folks, you work in an organization, you get on board, and then one day you become a people leader. And that opportunity there of supporting somebody who may report to you that has thoughts of suicide is really tricky and can be detrimental to the leader’s mental health when they don't feel like they have the tools and they don't feel safe to ask the questions. And may I just add super quick? The folks who are HR professionals, my goodness, some of you may have taken your training decades ago or years ago, the folks who decided to go into the world of HR may not have said, also I want to be a workplace mental health expert. And I do think it's quite unfair these days that many HR professionals are just, it's just assumed that you would like to take on the role of workplace mental health support or play suicide prevention. That's okay, we'll just go to HR. I do think we need to stop and ask folks, do you want to take mental health first aid? Do you want to suicide prevention? Do you want these things? Because it's okay for folks to say no, that's not part of my role description. That's not part of my training, or to say, yes, I really want to embrace this, I find that I am with my internal clients having these kinds of conversations, and I want to be better prepared. So I'm sorry, I just want to give a shout-out to all the HR folks that are finding themselves doing the many, many things that I couldn't do. Plus, supporting workplace mental health, and maybe even workplace prevention.

Michelle

One of the things that I appreciate about you, Tara, is your frankness and forwardness, that no, I really do. Because again, a lot of times it's blanket training. And there can be a variety of reasons why someone may not want to take that training and say that's beyond what I'm interested in doing, beyond what I feel that I can personally take on because it's big, right? It can be really big. It's a little bit like me taking first aid training. So I've received training, but quite honestly, I don't want to have to ever employ those skills ever. And I would, but then in the instances where I've been in those situations, I've been with my spouse, and I've said, Hey, husband, can you go call 911, I'm going to take over here, but go call 911, we need some help here. And because that's the right thing to do. But I'd rather not really have to employ those skills. So I think that's really...

Tara

Take that analogy and imagine you're in a situation. But imagine there's more than one or two folks around and everybody was able to pitch in and help the person they need plus each other. That would be beautiful. So if we were in the workplace, and let's say I had thoughts of suicide, and I chose to share that with you, Michelle, or you had enough training to ask me, whatever that situation. Both of us need some support.

Michelle

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So we're already at the time, Tara, I'd like to close with one question. You and I are on the same page in terms of goals of creating healthier, more sustainable workplace cultures. We're on the same page there our approaches are different, or our goal is the same. What is one thing that our viewers could do today, that will help make that change?

Tara

Embrace the soft skill training, your role, whatever it is, whatever your expertise is, you know, being a master of your skill is amazing. Embracing some of these soft skill trainings, should your organization have the resources this is the thing that makes me so excited. The workplace ends up covering many of the most high-risk groups in suicide prevention, whether it's gender, age or demographics. And because each one of us is part of many, many systems, the workplace, to me is this exponential opportunity, because each of us, belongs to the system within our workplace. And then we leave work and we are part of our family, our faith, our hobbies, etc, our community, our neighbourhood, etc. And so I always feel like when organizations invest in workplace mental health or workplace suicide prevention, they are having such an amazing ripple effect throughout our community and our population. So I just hoped that that would inspire folks to think about the soft skill training and organizations to really invest in the mental health and suicide prevention piece because the ROI is amazing. There is a high cost of emotional labour sometimes I always say it's worth it.

Michelle

Yeah, absolutely. It's always it's always worth it. There are always nuggets of information. And you know what, you take the training and you're never faced with someone who suggests they're going to take their life. That's okay. That's even better. That's even better. Yeah. Thank you so much, Tara for being here. On that day. If you want to connect with Tara. She's here on LinkedIn, Tara Adams with Abridge Consulting. Before we close, I want to share with everyone here today, and maybe you'd like to join us as well, Tara, because you're in business, you you also do content creation. And on July 17, is the next Mindful Monday, I'll be joined by Senior Learning and Development Specialist, Petra Mayer of Petra Mayer & Associates Consulting. And this is all about how to captivate your audience with custom learning programs. So we're going to hear more about how Petra and her team enhance course delivery and improve the success metrics through the use of attractive, high-value content that engages learners. So that's on July the 17th. If there are folks online with us, I can't see you. I can't even see the chat today. I'm really disappointed about that because there are always great questions from you. I want to thank all of our viewers, for joining us here today. Thank you again, Tara. Thank you again for dealing with some challenging tech issues.

Tara

No worries.

Michelle

All right, well, I wish everyone a great rest of their day and you as well Tara, and until next time, be well.